Curse

Soryuju · Jun 19, 2011, 07:07 PM // 19:07

Hi, all. So, I'm relatively new to GW, having started about a month ago, and I decided to main a Mesmer for PvE, despite hearing that it was one of the most difficult classes to play. I definitely enjoy it, but I'm sure there are ways that I can be more efficient at what I do. I am familiar with PvX Wiki, but unfortunately, I don't own EotN, so a number of the builds there don't work for me, and that led me here in search of advice. Here's what I'm currently running:

Me/A

Fast Casting: 8+1
Domination Magic: 8+1+2
Inspiration Magic: 11
Deadly Arts: 9

+15/-1 Wand (20% Domination HSR)
+12 energy/+30 HP Focus (20% Inspiration HSR)
Full Survivor Set

HP: 525
Energy: 57

Wastrel's Demise/Worry
Cry of Frustration
Cry of Pain
Ether Signet
Ether Feast
Assassin's Promise
Overload
Empathy

The main focus of the build is a basic combo between Wastrel's Demise, Cry of Pain, and Assassin's Promise. After I cast Wastrel's Demise on an enemy, I follow up quickly with Cry of Pain, which provides a small damage spike and interrupts any skill they might start using. That gives the damage from WD some time to build (I can almost always get up to the 3rd burst of damage, and it's not uncommon to reach the 4th, as well). I use AP after CoP, and the damage coming from my heroes and henchmen is usually enough to kill targets from that point. Then I repeat the process. I've also experimented some with Wastrel's Worry in place of WD, though so far I prefer WD's consistency.

The remainder of the skills are basically designed to try to fill the holes in the combo. Cry of Frustration is an extra interrupt and source of damage if an enemy continues using skills after CoP. If an enemy is using skills too often for WD to be practical, I use Overload to try to score some damage and act as a setup hex for CoP. Empathy is for melee enemies who spam attack skills. Ether Feast is mostly there for insurance, and I'm experimenting with Ether Signet for e-management, with mixed results. I'm considering ditching it for something like Auspicious Incantation, but I'm not sure yet.

My goal as a Mesmer is to be able to deal decent, consistent AoE damage to mobs while still being able to interrupt skills efficiently. Sort of like an elementalist with less damage and more disruption, I guess. I feel like my current build falls a bit short, and I'm open to all suggestions for getting it closer to where I'd like it. I'm not committed to having a WD or AP build, so if other skills/secondary professions would give me better results, I'd be more than happy to try them out. Also, if I'm leaving out any important information that might help with suggestions, just let me know. Thanks in advance!

Outerworld · Jun 19, 2011, 08:17 PM // 20:17

First thing that springs to mind is your attributes and equipment;

You should never sit on a 15/-1 wand for an extended period of time, they're more for emergency situations.
Extra armour is more valuable then extra health, meaning full Survivors is rather wasted and could instead be replaced by armour insignias (Blessed, Prodogies ect).
The build itself isn't a bad first attempt but sadly Empathy has limited value in PvE and Ether Sig isn't that great either, I would look into Power Drain as a possible replacement.
I'd also consider lowering the Insp points and pumping a bit more into Domination for the extra damage.

Hope this was helpful too you.

Soryuju · Jun 19, 2011, 10:32 PM // 22:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Outerworld

First thing that springs to mind is your attributes and equipment;

You should never sit on a 15/-1 wand for an extended period of time, they're more for emergency situations.
Extra armour is more valuable then extra health, meaning full Survivors is rather wasted and could instead be replaced by armour insignias (Blessed, Prodogies ect).
The build itself isn't a bad first attempt but sadly Empathy has limited value in PvE and Ether Sig isn't that great either, I would look into Power Drain as a possible replacement.
I'd also consider lowering the Insp points and pumping a bit more into Domination for the extra damage.

Hope this was helpful too you.

Aye, thanks for the advice. The reason I've got the 15/-1 wand is because the build used to be more energy-intensive, with skills like Arcane Echo involved, and I never really got around to changing it (which is also why I have a lot of points in Inspiration) . Though I don't mind replacing the wand, the only time the build runs into problems with energy management is when AP gets removed from a target early, and even then, the battle has to drag on for a while. Ether Signet was included as a "safety net" of sorts, since that sort of situation does still happen. I'll definitely consider dropping ES for Power Drain, though. I hesitated to include PD at first because it was a situational energy gain, but thinking about it now, it's far less situational than ES, and can help give me more interrupting power.

About the armor, the main reason I'm running Survivor's Insignias is because a lot of the other options for Mesmers wouldn't function very consistently with my build. Thanks to Assassin's Promise, my skills don't spend a lot of time recharging, so Prodigy feels kind of risky. I hesitate with Blessed because I'm not consistently enchanted. Would Forsaken maybe be worthwhile, since that's the case?

Again, thanks for the help. ^^

Outerworld · Jun 19, 2011, 10:53 PM // 22:53

Unfortunately Forsaken Insignias are Dervish only so thats not an option for you.

farmerfez · Jun 19, 2011, 10:55 PM // 22:55

just run e surge

**Marty Silverblade** · Jun 19, 2011, 11:03 PM // 23:03

Forsaken is a Dervish insignia. Mesmers cannot use them. That said, they're probably not worth running anyway. There'll be enchants flying around later on like Aegis and Prot Spirit so you can't really rely on the armor bonus with that either.

Soryuju · Jun 20, 2011, 12:16 AM // 00:16

Oh, completely overlooked that little detail about the Forsaken Insignias. My bad. XD

With that said, what sort of insignias should I run for the AP build, if Survivors still aren't satisfactory? Or if I were to take Farmerfez's advice and go with Energy Surge, what sort of skills/equipment should I use to keep my damage output consistent, while still maintaining good interruption ability? The 15 second recharge on Energy Surge makes me feel like I'd need some other decent source of damage, but maybe I've just been running AP too long and have gotten used to instant recharge. =P

**Marty Silverblade** · Jun 20, 2011, 01:27 AM // 01:27

-Do you have a vigor rune? They're expensive but free up your insignia slots. Without one you'd be under 500 health without Survivors which is getting into the uncomfortable zone.

-Regarding the recharge on ES, don't forget that Fast Casting helps. 40/40 sets help too. http://www.guildwiki.org/40/40

gremlin · Jun 20, 2011, 03:25 AM // 03:25

You can of course carry spare armour pieces and swap them as you swap your builds around.
My preference is for 4 head pieces each with a different rune tend to do that on some of my characters.
So you could have +1 +1 Domination or Inspiration etc

You do not always need maximum points in a skill list but using runes can give you a free points boost.

cataphract · Jun 20, 2011, 11:28 AM // 11:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by farmerfez

just run e surge

E-surge ftw. I'm having lots of fun with this at the moment: [OQZFAZMCP5GyJsEZgGkDmOyIAA]. Although Empathy isn't that great it's nice to have just to bother those rangers and/or warriors while you unleash your AoE on balled up casters.

Cuilan · Jun 20, 2011, 04:48 PM // 16:48

@cataphract

You have 1 in Water Magic and 3 in Illusion when you could put those few points in ritualist resurrect or something instead of Resurrection Signet. Auspicious Incantation would be better than the glyph for more energy at 10 Inspiration and would allow you to use your secondary.

Soryuju · Jun 20, 2011, 05:14 PM // 17:14

I don't have a Vigor rune at the moment, but I can probably get one soon. Is the extra 9 HP from the Rune of Superior Vigor worth the extra cost (about 20 platinum, the last I checked), or is a Rune of Major Vigor good enough?

Also, on the subject of Runes, is it worth it to invest in a Rune of Recovery? I know that Dazed and Deep Wound are both pretty nasty conditions, but is a 20% drop in their duration significant enough to make a difference? Or would I just be better off sticking to Runes of Vitae and those that boost my attributes?

I'm going to start investigating E-Surge today, since it does seem promising. Not sure if that's what I'll end up sticking with, but it's still certainly worth a try. Again, thanks to everyone who's provided suggestions so far!

Calista Blackblood · Jun 20, 2011, 05:19 PM // 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cuilan

@cataphract

You have 1 in Water Magic and 3 in Illusion when you could put those few points in ritualist resurrect or something instead of Resurrection Signet. Auspicious Incantation would be better than the glyph for more energy at 10 Inspiration and would allow you to use your secondary.

It really doesn't matter where the extra points are. The difference to FOMF % is laughable and DPS requires 15 Resto to be anywhere near as good as UA.

You are right though, AI would be much better over Glyph if the bar had something like Deep Freeze,it's pointlessly wasted otherwise.

Mad Barbie · Jun 20, 2011, 05:56 PM // 17:56

this is what I run when I'm lazy and play Esurge :P

Fastcast: 9+1
Domination: 12+1+1
Inspiration: 9+1
Resto: 3

Full prodigy insignias, sup vigor, rune of vitae

Using a 40/40 Domination set for this bar

Mind Wrack - Esurge - unnatural signet - shatter delusions - mistrust - pdrain - ether signet - flesh

If you like more rupts you could kick shatter for cry

Edit: Rune of Recovery is a waste normally your monks should remove the conds fast enough ^^

Cuilan · Jun 20, 2011, 06:34 PM // 18:34

Suggested a ritualist one since they don't require much energy and can be reused. I also wasn't assuming the player plays with UA heroes or people, as he/she can drop the resurrect. Spending 5 energy to gain 25 with Arcane Echo was my suggestion because it was similar to GoLE.

Calista Blackblood · Jun 20, 2011, 06:52 PM // 18:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cuilan

Spending 5 energy to gain 25 with Arcane Echo was my suggestion because it was similar to GoLE.

Spending 20 energy total to gain 5 energy is not the best practice at all.

gremlin · Jun 20, 2011, 07:24 PM // 19:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soryuju

I don't have a Vigor rune at the moment, but I can probably get one soon. Is the extra 9 HP from the Rune of Superior Vigor worth the extra cost (about 20 platinum, the last I checked), or is a Rune of Major Vigor good enough?

Also, on the subject of Runes, is it worth it to invest in a Rune of Recovery? I know that Dazed and Deep Wound are both pretty nasty conditions, but is a 20% drop in their duration significant enough to make a difference? Or would I just be better off sticking to Runes of Vitae and those that boost my attributes?

I'm going to start investigating E-Surge today, since it does seem promising. Not sure if that's what I'll end up sticking with, but it's still certainly worth a try. Again, thanks to everyone who's provided suggestions so far!

If your rich get the best vigor rune you can but there is nothing wrong with starting with a minor vigor +30 and working up as you find better ones or get the cash.
Don't forget you can get weapon sets that give health too, some staffs give you + 60 health which is nice.

Many shields give you +30 I often run my mesmer with a +30 shield and a spear giving +5 energy as the ai tends to home in on those using caster weapons.
Common enough to have several weapon sets to maximise energy or health etc.

As for runes of recovery, never bothered myself.
Given that your a mesmer a master of interrupts you shouldn't need to worry too much about being dazed etc, and if you are caught out just kite for a while and let the party carry the load till you get it removed.

Cuilan · Jun 20, 2011, 07:29 PM // 19:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calista Blackblood

Spending 20 energy total to gain 5 energy is not the best practice at all.

Spending 5 energy to save at most 20 energy with the non-spell GoLE.

Spending 5 energy with AI to gain 25 to spend on Arcane Echo and more than likely Energy Surge.

Calista Blackblood · Jun 20, 2011, 07:41 PM // 19:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cuilan

Spending 5 energy to save at most 20 energy with the non-spell GoLE.

Spending 5 energy with AI to gain 25 to spend on Arcane Echo and more than likely Energy Surge.

No not at all. You do gain 25 energy but not to spend on AE,you have to cast AE to gain anything so that is totally wrong.Your net gain of 5 energy is after casting costs of both AI and AE are taken into consideration.

Not worth the effort in normal PvE.

Cuilan · Jun 20, 2011, 08:22 PM // 20:22

GoLE reduces the cost of two skills after it and you'll be using two skills after AI if you use it with AE. Going from GoLE, AE, and then ES leads you to spend 10 energy while AI'ed AE covers the cost assuming energy bar can fit it. There isn't any effort unless one finds using skills in a small pattern difficult.